Psychedelics for Therapeutic Optimization with Shawn Wells

Welcome to Biohacker's Podcast, where we explore the latest advancements in health,

biohacking and general human optimization.

I'm Teemu Arina from Biohacker Center and today we have a truly

mind-expanding topic to explore.

We're going to discuss nothing else than psychedelics and

their use for mental health.

I'm thrilled to have a renowned wellness expert and biochemist Shawn

Wells as our guest speaker today.

Shawn is here to share his insights on the science of psychedelics,

their effectiveness in clinical studies, and the challenges and

opportunities of psychedelic therapy.

As a biochemist, he will discuss the role of neurotransmitters beyond serotonin

in mood regulation, supplements to enhance the effects of psychedelics,

Different microdosing protocols, and carefully designed stacks to use

before and after a psychedelic journey.

You may have heard about microdosing, where you take below a threshold

noticeable dose of a psychedelic for mood enhancement, productivity or creativity.

This has gained popularity especially in the creative tech

elite in San Francisco and beyond.

I will share some of the details about microdosing after

Shawn Wells' presentation.

One of the fascinating new terms that Shawn Wells introduces in

his presentation is echo dosing.

This means that after a proper journey you take an echo of a microdose,

sometimes repeatedly, to help you with the integration process.

It's a fascinating alchemical concept for sure to get the most out of your

therapeutic sessions with psychedelics.

It has been addressed by several experts throughout this last few decades that

it's really important to have a proper time and methods for integration work.

But before we dive into this intriguing topic, let me tell you

a little bit about Shawn Wells.

With his extensive background in biochemistry and formulation, Shawn

has been on the forefront of the wellness industry for years, working

on unique supplement formulations and novel compounds, such as

theacrine, dynamine and paraxanthine.

All of these are optimized derivatives of stimulants such as caffeine.

I'm sure we will cover some of that work of optimizing caffeine in future episodes.

Now, Shawn has also served on the editorial board of the Journal of the

International Society of Sports Nutrition, so he certainly knows what he is talking

about when he dives into novel compounds.

In this presentation, Shawn shares an intimate personal story on

how psychedelics transformed his life, especially in dealing with

depression and suicidal thoughts.

Then he explores the therapeutic potential of psychedelics and shares

some of his advice as a biochemist.

Now let's hear from the man himself, Shawn Wells, as he takes us on a journey through

the world of psychedelics and their potential for mental health optimization.

Get ready for some really mind-expanding, eye-opening, compelling research

and practical recommendations from a true expert in the field.

Over to you, Shawn.

We are in Amsterdam and this is a very apt topic, psychedelics.

It's been a huge part of my life, a massive shift for me.

Psychedelics transformed who I was.

I was on the edge of suicide at several points in my life.

And if you know me, I've talked a lot about mental health, the

depression I've dealt with.

So this is a topic that's very close to my heart.

And I took my biochemistry knowledge, I took my formulation knowledge that I've

been doing for 20 years, and I brought that into the world of psychedelics,

and I'm now working on unique strains, unique stacks, protocols, and...

Looking at the therapeutic aspects and the science of the psychedelics, but I'll

have you know, it's very important to understand that there is a deep spiritual

aspect to these that I'm not going to delve into and I'm not an expert in.

I'm not a shaman.

I'm not a guru.

I'm not ayahuasquero.

I'm not one of these people that are so brilliant at navigating those spaces,

and I'm not going to pretend to be.

These statistics should stun you.

This is when I realized I'm not alone.

And I think many of you that have dealt with depression, PTSD, anxiety,

suicidal thoughts may feel alone.

It's natural to feel that way.

But look at these numbers, 23% more patients are on antidepressants than

five years prior, that's a massive jump.

These things are just being given out like crazy.

And of course, we know what's been happening the last few

years is playing a role in that.

308 million people worldwide have PTSD.

That's almost the population of the United States.

Again, a stunning number.

10.3 million adults had serious suicidal thoughts.

An increase of nearly half a million people from the year prior.

You want to know the pandemic?

This is it.

This is the pandemic.

Mental health.

And as you're seeing mental health come to the forefront, you're seeing more studies.

You're seeing the efficacy not be shunned anymore of these compounds,

of MDMA, of psilocybin, ketamine.

Now you're seeing all these studies come in.

And you're also seeing money come in.

And, that's been the huge shift in these things becoming more

legal, is there's money to be made.

And you're seeing the regulatory impacts of that with a Biden administration trying

to make some of these things more legal.

But I think globally, you will see everything shift.

Certain states have already shifted in the United States.

Certainly Amsterdam, you're seeing this be a place where a lot of

these things are somewhat legal.

And there will be a global change that's coming.

The next five to 10 years, there will be radical shifts.

And so we need to know the science behind these ingredients as more

people will start to use them.

The popular psychedelics that are being used in research are

psilocybin, MDMA, ketamine, and now somewhat LSD and ibogaine.

But it's important to see this research is using facilitated psychotherapy.

So these psychedelics are yes being given, but they're being given in the right set

and setting with the right people that are helping set intentions, do the integration

work, as well as a facilitated experience.

They're there with you throughout the experience.

When you don't have this, you just have a journey on your own - and those can

be special, but when you talk to a lot of people like, "oh, I've done this

recreationally", that's so different than someone guiding you and someone

helping you integrate this work.

I can tell you there's nothing worse than coming out of a psychedelic

experience, seeing your truth, and then going back to your regular

life and doing nothing about it.

You feel worse.

You can come out of of these experiences feeling worse if

you don't have the facilitation.

In one dose of psilocybin with depressed patients, there was

a 10% growth of the neurons.

They got 10% bigger and there was 10% more.

These are your brain cells.

It's bringing the brain back online.

Your brain can actually shrink with depression.

It becomes less functional with depression.

It's trying to save itself, save energy, feel less.

The brain is coming back online.

71% of the people, this is a psilocybin study with depression.

71% of the people who took the psilocybin had a 50% or more reduction in

depression symptoms in just four weeks.

Do you ever hear about that with these antidepressant drugs?

At the conclusion of the study, 50% of those participants did not need

to have further medical intervention.

Essentially, they were cured.

That's pretty stunning.

Here's another study, Johns Hopkins with psilocybin.

This was a 12-month study.

They continued to do that integration work and follow-up.

58% needed no further treatment at 12 months.

60% of people, essentially.

6 out of 10 needed no further treatment.

You think we should be talking about this?

It's frustrating to me that we're not talking about this.

That this is being considered drugs, that this is considered illegal or immoral.

And even if you feel that way, I can tell you as someone who's battled

depression and suicidal thoughts, and certainly been friends with people

that are soldiers, or EMT people.

Or sexual abuse victims, that they need help and they're not getting access to it.

And that frustrates me.

It may not be your thing, but let's not make it no one's thing.

When these could be clear solution.

MDMA.

42 participants that got MDMA.

By the way, I love how this is set up.

Again, set up the right way.

This isn't just clinical studies and let's just give this ingredient

at a clinical environment.

This is three 90-minute preparatory sessions, three 8-hour experimental

sessions based one month apart where they discuss things and

they do this integration work.

They're following up.

They're connecting with them.

How are you doing?

How can we help you?

Let's guide you.

You're not in this alone.

And so what do we see?

67% no longer met the diagnostic criteria of PTSD.

Two out of three people.

These numbers are massive.

This is cures, solutions, and it's not getting out there.

How much have you guys heard this data, On psilocybin and MDMA, you're hearing it?

That's good that some of you are.

But clearly it's not making its way out to everyone.

Probably not making its way to your doctor who's continuing to escalate

the prescriptions for antidepressants.

Ketamine, fast acting.

This one is legal in the US in a clinical environment.

It's the speedster of antidepressants.

Works within hours.

It's incredible in particular for PTSD because it has a dissociative

effect, and people can see themselves apart from their trauma.

Our ego tends to lock into trauma and make that a part of your identity.

It feels like this is who I am, this is what I deserve.

And you're scared of who you would be without your trauma.

It sounds good to say you don't want the trauma, but in reality,

you're so deeply tied to it.

And ketamine can dissociate you from that.

It's like putting down your backpack, and then taking a look at it and saying, I

don't need to wear that backpack anymore.

This feels good without it.

can see what this feels like now without that.

And I feel good.

And so we see it's a speedster.

It works far faster than SSRIs.

Let's talk about SSRIs.

The serotonin theory has been going around for years, and it's

And the idea of SSRIs, selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, making you circulate

more serotonin, because serotonin is the feel-good neurotransmitter.

So this is all about serotonin.

And in reality, we're not seeing the great benefits that they're talking about.

The serotonin theory of depression has been one of the most influential

and extensively researched biological theories on depression.

And where are we?

Those suicide rates are going up.

Those PTSD rates are going up.

Depression's going up.

If antidepressants exert their effects as as placebos or by numbing

emotions, then it is not clear that they do any more good than, harm.

This is from a meta-analysis where they looked at all the studies on SSRIs.

The conclusions.

The benefits of antidepressants seem to be minimal and possibly

without any importance to the average patient with MDR.

Antidepressants should not be used for adults with major depressive

disorder before valid evidence has shown that the potential beneficial

effects outweigh the harmful effects.

And so we're fed this idea that it's all about serotonin.

And we have a lot of neurotransmitters.

There's a lot going on in the brain.

And just inhibiting this one path isn't the whole solution.

I do like the idea of serotonin.

I don't dismiss the value of serotonin in depression, but

it's not the only solution.

It's not the one thing to look at.

So looking at serotonin is an oversimplification.

And I wanna look at all these neurotransmitters of which

there's excitatory, inhibitory, modulatory neurotransmitters.

And these are the key one.

It's not just serotonin.

Acetylcholine, glutamate, dopamine, norepinephrine, histamine,

GABA, glycine, endorphins.

These are all playing a role in your mood and your brain health.

And you can see here, yes, serotonin is depressed in those that suffer from

depression, PTSD, anxiety, But so is glutamate, norepinephrine, GABA, dopamine.

Do you know what won't bring those back online?

An SSRI.

Do you know what does bring all of those neurotransmitters back online?

That's right.

Psychedelics do.

It has a global impact on the brain.

And we see because of that, and by the way, a lot of depression is correlated

to neuro inflammation as well as fatigue, that psychedelics reduce that inflammation

both systemically and neurologically.

It also improves the immune system.

We get the immune system back online.

But I want you to know that each of these psychedelics work differently.

They don't all work the same way.

So there may be one that's more tailored to you, and your experience.

Neuroplasticity is super key.

It's how resilient your brain is.

a lot about resilience here in biohacking.

A lot of these talks have been about that.

When your brain is depressed it's not resilient.

You're low in BDNF, brain derived neurotrophic factor,

and you stay in loops.

When I was very depressed, someone would say one thing to me and

for hours I would sit on that.

I would stew on that.

I would stay in my loop.

It was very unhealthy.

I didn't quickly reframe in a neuroplastic way.

So it's associated with BDNF, also NGF, also mTOR.

So there's several proteins.

It's an oversimplification again to say just BDNF.

But it's important to think about these neurons when your

neuroplastic can unwire and rewire.

We can throw fresh powder on the tracks if you've been going down these tracks

for years because there they are, there's your tracks and here's your skis.

You can throw fresh powder on the trail and and blaze a

new path, a whole new path.

This is what can happen when BDNF is elevated.

Let's read this quote.

Participants ranked their psilocybin experience as one of the most meaningful

in their lives, comparable to the birth of a first child or the death of a parent.

Two-thirds of the participants rated the session among their top

five most spiritually significant experiences of their lives.

One-third ranked it the most significant such experience in their lives,

above marriage, above the death of a parent, above the birth of a child.

I love Michael Pollan, and there is a documentary out on

Netflix that does a great job.

He has a book as well.

This goes through ketamine and psilocybin.

I recommend watching it.

And so here's the way I believe psychedelics work.

It's not just neurotransmitters.

That's what science has said for years is that psychedelics are

all about neurotransmitters and you having a chemical imbalance.

They've said for years that mostly it's serotonin.

And you can see what a gross oversimplification that is.

That it's about neuroplasticity, it's about hacking the ego, turning off

default mode network, it's about.

Dissociation, getting into that parasympathetic state, that relaxed state.

When I was working on psychedelics, I had rarely ever

been in a parasympathetic state.

I was always vigilant, inflammation modulation and ketones.

So supplements, I'm a supplement guy, adaptogens are amazing.

I think all of you should be taking them.

Cycle through them.

Things like rhodiola, ashwagandha, they have a bimodal effect.

They can energize you and relax you.

And that's where we want to be.

That's the flow state.

That's in the balance of sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system.

Supplements that can enhance blood flow to the brain would

obviously be ideal in a journey.

Things like niacin, ginkgo biloba, vinpocetine, acetyl l-carnitine.

Electrolytes and hydration.

This is one you probably hear, but I'll definitely reinforce.

Getting your LMNT or your electrolyte blends.

Certainly getting magnesium and just taking some table salt if

you have that and certainly water.

CBD, hopefully this is available to you.

The cannabidiol can have a profound impact.

I could do a whole talk on just the ECS, the endocannabinoid system,

the master regulator system.

It's controlling mood, pain, inflammation.

Immunity, and yet there's no doctor specializing in the

endocannabinoid system that I know of.

And so there's so much research to be done on these cannabinoids

and the impact that they can have.

In particular, some things like MDMA have been theorized to be potentially mildly,

at least temporarily neurotoxic, so it might be ideal to take some of these

neuroprotectant supplements, vitamin C, carotenoids, polyphenols, mitochondrial

enhancers, curcumin, cannabinoids.

So I don't hate serotonin and certainly when you're coming out

of these experiences with your massive growth abundance, you can

feel that contraction afterwards.

And getting serotonin back online is ideal.

I love Zembrin, which is a Canna extract, a natural SSRI.

I wouldn't use an SSRI constantly, but I like the idea of post-journey

having serotonin build back up faster.

And that's going to help when you're taking some of these other ones that are

giving you the foundation to do that.

So saffron, especially standardized for safranol, SAMe, 5-hydroxy tryptophan.

This is a really good stack, this Canna and 5-HTP.

And then vitamin D3.

Acetylcholine, when you're focused, when you're doing deep work, if your

journey is like one where you're really thinking and going in and not just being

playful and loving and whatever, then acetylcholine is probably depleted.

And so getting acetylcholine back online is important, so you don't feel

low energy, low productivity for the days and weeks following your journey.

So acetylcholine is going to come back online with acetylocarnitine, the acetyl

group donor, alpha-GPC or Citicoline for the choline piece, and then Huperzine A

as an acetylcholine esterase inhibitor.

Anxiolytic supplements.

These are supplements that reduce your anxiety.

This is great if you just have anxiety in general, but sometimes going into journey

experiences can be anxiety inducing.

The journey typically starts when you commit to the journey, not when

you're necessarily doing the journey.

I've had people be in a car with me going through a journey over a

four-hour drive and they're losing their minds because stuff's coming

up from unconscious to subconscious to the conscious mind and now they're

thinking on what's about to happen.

And so being able to lean in to get into parasympathetic is going

to make these compounds much more effective, like psilocybin.

The better you get at doing these journeys, the lower your doses

of these substances should be because you're training yourself

to be more parasympathetic.

It's not like a body size thing.

It's actually my nervous system.

I might take twice as much because I'm coming into the journey

like I was just in traffic.

I'm a type A personality.

What's about to happen?

People are going to see me.

I'm freaking out.

I'm going to need more to get overpowered to get into that parasympathetic state.

Whereas if Amy's already coming in.

Parasympathetic, it's going to take a much lower dose.

So microdosing, LSD, I tend to associate with positivity, happiness,

blissfulness, insightfulness, creativity.

This has been a powerful tool for many.

Typically microdosing is at 1 tenth the, more experiential light journey dose.

And this is Fadiman's protocol where you do 10 micrograms every third day.

And you can stack it with other nootropics, things like

N-acetyltyrosine, things like the race TAMs like Piracetam or Noopept.

Ketamine reset, I really think this is cool.

This is by Dr.

Matt Cook.

So when he does his ketamine protocol, he's also giving things to reset

the mitochondria like CoQ10, like NAD, and he's giving stem cells.

So he's giving the body a chance to go down this path of full reset

physiologically and neurologically.

What better time?

You will be far more receptive to these things, making change to you

using them when you're in this state.

And that's what he's seen.

He's seen a dramatic change versus just giving exosomes or giving

stem cells, giving NAD, when you do this, it's much better.

This is Paul Stamets protocol for microdosing psilocybin,

lion's mane, niacin, etc.

So I wanted to talk quickly about a few ingredients.

L-ergothionine.

This one's a mitochondrial antioxidant.

It's brand new and it's being looked at as a potential new vitamin.

It protects the mitochondria.

It's a pretty breakthrough and is one of the things that I would

recommend using post-journey.

This one smokes lion's mane.

Smokes lion's mane.

It's better than injecting BDNF.

That's stunning.

7,8-Dihydroxyflavone is is the ultimate thing I know of for a brain-derived

neurotrophic factor, for neuroplasticity.

And maybe its metabolite could be even better, but there's

even less research on that.

The 4-DMA-78-Dihydroxyflavone.

This one, Dihydromyrocetin, is potent at helping with hangovers.

Not just alcohol hangovers, but I've been using it with journeys

when you tend to feel low, brain fog, exhausted that next day or two.

This one can help quite a bit.

And yes, if you're going out drinking, this would be a good one to take.

Paraxanthine is a breakthrough metabolite of caffeine.

Caffeine is toxic and actually is a toxin in plants to repel bugs.

We convert caffeine to paraxanthine.

This is the thing we want.

This is the thing that has all the benefits.

The theophylline is toxic.

Theobromine largely has no benefit.

And so for 60% of us, we're slow metabolizers of caffeine and we're stuck

with side effects more than benefits in this caffeinated state and not getting

the paraxanthine and so we see with paraxanthine, neuroprotective increases

glutathione and catalase, increases dopamine and serotonin, improved blood

flow to the brain, increased BDNF, greater focus, memory, accuracy, energy.

This is a breakthrough ingredient and I think will have a

profound impact in this space.

Experiment with some of these things.

I'm giving you all my tools.

You don't need to use all of them.

Bring your brain back online to be more productive, to

have a better mood day to day.

Thank you.

Thank you very much Shawn Wells for sharing your personal story and advice

on psychedelics for therapeutic use.

Now, let me share some insights on microdosing.

Microdosing involves using subperceptual doses of psychedelic substances.

Typically this means LSD or magic mushrooms, but many other classical

psychedelics have also been used, such as mescaline from cacti,

DMT from ayahuasca and related plants, and ibogaine from iboga.

For psilocybin mushrooms that means about 0.1 to 0.3 grams of dried

mushrooms, while a typical dose, macro dose, would be more than 2 grams.

For LSD the micro dose would be 5 to 20 micrograms of LSD, while typical

doses start from 100, 150 and up.

Scientific research on microdosing is limited, with most of the evidence

coming from anecdotal reports and self-reported experiences.

Perhaps the most prominent explorer of microdosing has been James Fadiman,

the co-founder of the Institute of Transpersonal Psychology and the author

of the Psychedelic Explorer's Guide.

Some of the anecdotal reports collected by Fadiman and others, and also some

studies, smaller studies, suggest the potential benefits of microdosing.

Number 1 - Some users report improved mood, increased well-being, and

enhanced positivity while microdosing.

Number 2 - Other users report improved cognitive function,

including increased creativity, problem-solving abilities, and focus.

Number 3 - Some others suggest that microdosing may have anxiety

and stress-reducing effects.

Number 4 - Microdosing has been associated with increased emotional awareness,

empathy, and better emotional regulation.

Number 5 - Some preliminary studies have also suggested that microdosing

may have potential benefits for mental health conditions such

as depression, anxiety and PTSD.

Now some limited studies have explored microdosing in a more controlled setting,

so let me share you a few of such studies.

The first study was conducted by Quantified Citizen QC and formally titled

"Psilocybin Microdosers Demonstrate Greater Observed Improvements In

Mood And Mental Health At One Month Relative To Non-Microdosing Controls".

The study shows that psilocybin microdosing is associated with general

improvements in mood and mental health.

Additionally, a finding specific to individuals over the age of 55 indicates

that microdosing was associated with greater improvements in psychomotor

performance, especially when stacked with lion's mane and niacin, which is

known as the infamous Paul Stamets stack.

This stack basically uses the flush version of niacin to make the brain

more receptive to the features of psilocybin and lion's mane to

stimulate the neural growth factors.

This may theoretically have potential use for treating mental decline and

different nervous system conditions, although no formal studies have

been conducted for this purpose yet.

studied LSD for microdosing.

The study was titled Repeated low doses of LSD in healthy adults, a

placebo-controlled dose response study, and it noted a slightly stimulant

effect but didn't really find any improvements in mood or performance.

On the safety side, a proper macro-dose on a not-so-regular basis seems to have,

been safe in cultural and historical settings, as most of these psychedelics

have been used by different cultures, including ayahuasca, mescaline and

psilocybin, for thousands of years.

The repeated daily micro-dosing and its longitudinal effects do not have

such a cultural or historical context.

It is important to note that LSD, for example, exerts its effects

through the serotonin 5-HT2A receptor.

And 5-HT2A receptors are expressed in many tissues and organs throughout

the human body, including the brain, gut and cardiovascular system.

This might be the reason why it has this stimulant effect.

There may be some issues on regularly stimulating these receptors on a

daily basis, but there is not enough evidence yet or research conclusions.

We might know soon a lot more, as psychedelics are being decriminalized

or or legalized in a number of countries and cities around the world.

For example, in US, in Oregon, San Francisco, Washington, Oakland, Santa

Cruz, Seattle, Detroit and Denver, psilocybin mushrooms are decriminalized.

So is in some countries like the Netherlands, Costa Rica, Bahamas,

Jamaica, Portugal and Brazil.

They have all made mushrooms either legal or decriminalized them.

For example, in Oregon, you can carry a personal possession of up

to 12 grams of psilocybin mushrooms.

On a more grey area, some countries in the world, such as Mexico and

Thailand, in some parts of them the locals do look through their fingers

when it comes to magic mushrooms.

On a more official side, in Oregon and Colorado, they have legislature

in place to allow the regulated access to psilocybin therapy sessions.

In Canada, they have also passed laws to allow psilocybin and MDMA sessions

under the Compassionate Access Scheme.

Now we will definitely dive deeper into psychedelics in future episodes.

You may be interested in our upcoming conference, the Biohacker

The theme of this conference is Expanding Consciousness in all its

various modalities from fasting and ice bathing to supplements and psychedelics.

You can learn more about the conference at biohackersummit.com.

Thank you very much for listening.

That's all guys, so expand your mind in a responsible way